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The Greater Toronto Area High School Basketball Forums

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    bk
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    Post by bk Mon Nov 17, 2008 1:10 pm

    my friends at the hoop-la tell me bishop macdonnell has lost only one game this year and that was to the university of waterloo in an exhibition game, they also finished second in ofsaa aa last year and return their entire team, they are well deserving of their seed i believe,
    did ascension play in any tourneys outside the gta, this may have also affected their ranking, many things come into play when you try to seed teams from all over the province, i guess the best thing to do for ascension is to beat them all and win ofsaa, and i think they really have a good shot at it, thats why they play the games
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    wcbasketball
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    Post by wcbasketball Mon Nov 17, 2008 1:27 pm

    We played Bishop McDonnell is a tournament last year and they are a very good team. They won the silver medal last year and if most of the team is back, then they definately deserve the high ranking.They also have had a great year this season.
    I agree that the placing by a team or region at OFSAA the year before should have nothing to do with ranking this year. I was a little surprised by Eastern Commerce being ranked number one as they did lose to some teams in out of town tournaments. I am very proud for them as they are representing us from the GTA but I believe that Waterloo should have been number 1. Ascension should definately be in the top five and Oakwood should not be one of the ranked teams so I think that OFSAA did a good job at the AA rankings. General Amhearst should be the number 1 seed based on their performance in tournaments this year.
    In AAA, Govenor Simcoe should be the number 1 seed. The next four in no particular oreder should be
    St Johns(Brantford)
    Louie Riel (Ottawa)
    Thomson (Toronto)
    St Marys (Hamilton)

    This is a top heavy tournament with some very weak teams on the bottom.
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    bk
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    Post by bk Mon Nov 17, 2008 1:32 pm

    fill me in wcbasketball on some of these AAA teams i will be watching in st catharines, i have seen some but do not know others, fill me in
    Xavier Rimrocker
    Xavier Rimrocker
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    Post by Xavier Rimrocker Mon Nov 17, 2008 4:59 pm

    AAA rankings are posted:

    1. Governor Simcoe
    2. St. John's
    3. Louis-Riel
    4. St. Christopher
    5. St. Mary
    6. East Elgin
    7. Thomson
    8. Regiopolis-Notre Dame


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    Xavier Rimrocker
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    Post by Xavier Rimrocker Mon Nov 17, 2008 5:02 pm

    A Rankings

    1. Rockway Mennonite
    2. Ashbury College
    3. Char-Lan
    4. Elliot Lake
    5. Blenheim
    6. Trinity College
    7. Holy Trinity
    8. Nouvelle Alliance


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    Eagle1
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    Post by Eagle1 Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:12 pm

    bk you say:

    "Did ascension play in any tourneys outside the gta, this may have also affected their ranking."

    Ascension played at the Sheridan, Rimrocker and Centennial tournaments widely considered to be (at least among) the elite tournaments featuring many of the top AAA and AAAA teams at OFSAA. They are also their league AAAA champions.

    After doing some looking around, it would seem the CWOSSA rep Bishop McDonnel and WOSAA rep Tilsonburg Glendale played almost exclusively against AA teams and did not attend any tournament with AAAA competition. At least General Amhearst played some stiff competition.

    In the end, the games will be played on the court. I will be presumptuous and make an assumption that Ascension will meet GA the semis. My only prediction will be that the winner of this game will beat the other semi-final winner quite handily in the final.

    If I am being GTA-centric and not giving enough credit to the other teams, I will gladly say so when the results come in.


    Last edited by Eagle1 on Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:44 am; edited 1 time in total
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    wcbasketball
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    Post by wcbasketball Tue Nov 18, 2008 3:13 am

    I remember Coach Blue posting a few days ago that the post by the General Amhearst coach was one of the best ever on Hooptown. This one in my opinion is one of the worst.
    "Eagle1", I must start my post by saying "WOW". I appreciate your enthusiasm but you are way off in your very critical post. I have to comment on what you said because it is based on a lot of misconceptions and has some way out of wack comments.
    First of all, I wouldn't make a crazy comment like you would wager your car that Ascension would beat Glendale(#3seed) by 40 points with their bench playing most of the game. That means that Michelle Asare and Christine Hyde would not play much at all. You are making some way off comparisons and if you have not seen teams like Bishop McDonell, Glendale and Stratford, then it is impossible for you to make such bold predictions. You are basing everything you say about the other teams from what you have read and not what you have seen. Have you watched any of the teams you dissed play this season? I will make a safe assumption and say no. Be careful what you wager, because you may be taking the bus a lot if the big stars on Ascension are sitting most of the game. Remember that they have to win by 41 points with their starters playing very little and their bench playing the majority of the game.To say, "don't take this the wrong way" is a blind comment because how could anybody take it any other way. You are completely disrespecting teams that you have no knowledge about. I will make the assumption that the Ascension coach doesn't agree with you and will not be putting his bench in and sitting his starters to prove your point.
    Next, you make a statement that Bishop McDonell played almost exclusively against AA teams and did not attend any tournament with AAAA competition. So what! Just because you are AAAA size doesn't mean that you field the best teams. General Amhearst is the best team in the province in my opinion right now and they AA. Governor Simcoe is one of the top five teams in the province and they are AAA. St Johns(Brantford) and Louis Riel (Ottawa) are arguably in the top five and they also are AAA. Eastern Commerce is a AA size school and Ascension is also a AA size school so this just proves that size doesn't matter. Everybody please refrain from making the usual joke associated with this comment. LOL!
    You also base your crazy post on the tournaments that Ascension participated in. You stated that all three tournaments(Sheridan, Rimrocker and Centennial) are widely considered to be at least among the elite tournaments. That is definately way off base and nowhere close to the truth. Sheridan had some very strong teams (D'Youville, Ascension) but also had some not very strong teams so that definately could not be considered one of the top tournaments in the province. Rimrocker has invited many of the top teams from out of town to his tournament but he was unsuccessful this year. The Rimrocker had only two out of town teams, St Francis(St Catherines) and Westside(Orangeville) and with mixed results. Orangeviile lost two of three games and St Francis lost in the consolation final. Though there was some strong representation from the GTA but top teams such as Eastern, Notre Dame(Ajax), Thomson, Pickering, Michael Power and Dunbarton were not there. A good tournament that will definately get even stronger in the future due to the hard work of the tournament organizer but not top five this year. I hate sounding like I am putting this tournament down because I think it will be a big draw and it is organized very well but I have to be honest in comparing it to the top ones in the province. No disrespect here Xavier Rimrocker and I am pretty sure you know where I am coming from and understand.
    Lastly, the Centennial tournament was the strongest tournament that involved SOLELY GTA teams. You had almost all of the top ten GTA teams in it but no out of town teams.It could be considered one of the elite tournaments but it still wasn't the top tournament held in the GTA. That belongs to the Etobicoke Rams classic that had:
    General Amhearst (AA #1 Seed)
    Waterloo (AAAA #2 Seed)
    Westdale Hamilton (AAAA #4 Seed)
    LaSalle (AA #8 Seed)
    St Marys Hamilton (AAA #5 Seed)
    Govenor Simcoe (AAA #1 Seed)
    Louis Riel (AAA #3 Seed)
    On top of these teams the tournament also had Etobicoke, Jarvis, Norte Dame(Burlington), St Annes, Oakridge, London South, Father Goetz, Michael Power and Chatham Kent.I know that you don't have much respect for Etobicoke as you were the one who pointed out that they were not even in the GTA top 20 teams awhile back. They are also at OFSAA! This(Etobicoke) was considered among the elite tournaments. Other top notch tournaments were the Purple and White and Fanshawe(Both London) and the St Marys tourny in Hamilton. I know that there are others but I wanted to point a few out.
    I agree that Ascension is a great team with two of the best players in the GTA and certainly deserves to be at OFSAA but don't come on here and take apart other teams and disrespect them with ridiculous comments like "I would wager my car that Ascension would beat Stratford by 40 points with their bench playing most of the game" and stating that every tournament that Ascension played in was top notch. I am cheering for Ascension as I feel that they will do us proud at OFSAA but I certainly wouldn't want to give other teams chalkboard material to get them more motivated then they already will be. I highly doubt that Bishop McDonnel and Tillsonburg Glendale would be ranked 2-3 if they were so bad that the #5 team could beat them with their bench. You are looking past these teams and assuming a semi-final date with General Amhearst. Nothing is guaranteed, that is why we play the games. I distincly remember a 17-0 NFL team last year that was practically handed the Super Bowl before it was even played. The problem is that somebody forgot to give the New York Giants the memo and we ended up with one of the greatest upsets in history.
    A few weeks I was critical of the North region teams in the Toronto region and some people felt that I was too harsh. They were all entitled to their opinion as you are but I based my points on the knowledge of those teams and it wasn't top seeds at OFSAA. I knew what I was talking about.
    I wish all Toronto teams the best as we have an excellent chance of bringing home a championship or at least a medal in the AA, AAA and AAAA with Ascension and Eastern Commerce being our best bets. I just won't bet my car.LOL!
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    Post by bk Tue Nov 18, 2008 7:55 am

    well said wcbasketball, it can be difficult at times but degrading young people on an open forum is not the way to make a point, my questions regarding ascension were just that questions, i attended the purple and white, st marys ,sosi and the etobicoke tourneys and did not see them play, i hear great things and wish them well ! generally ofsaa officials do a pretty good job rating teams, ascension has had a great year, now they can prove everyone they are the best, time will tell!
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    Eagle1
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    Post by Eagle1 Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:43 am

    wcbasketball - my post was directed to bk. I don't know who you are. It would be easier to respond if I did. My opinions are solely mine. I don't have time to respond to all of your (long-winded) reply. GEEZE, take a breather. I enjoy the discussions but let's not get crazy here.

    If you feel my comment about Stratford is disrespectul, fine - I will remove it so as not to offend Stratford. I wanted to make the point that you cannot base seeding based on the team record - the level of the competition MUST be considered. Based on what I saw, the two teams I mentioned (Glendale and McDonnel) have NOT played the same level of competition as Ascension. That is what I wanted to hear some discussion about.

    BTW I never said that Ascension would beat those two teams with their bench. Read the post again.

    I also did say that I was being presumptuous assuming a Ascension vs. GA semi. It is again my opinion that that will happen.

    And to repeat what I posted earlier:
    If I am being GTA-centric and not giving enough credit to the other teams, I WILL GLADLY say so when the results come in.

    Those who have known me post on Hooptown since the inception of this forum (many years ago) know that I do not make excuses when my team loses and I will always give credit when it is deserved. I have also never hidden my identity.

    One last point. You say:

    "You are basing everything you say about the other teams from what you have read and not what you have seen." That is exactly what the seeding committee must do and that brings me back to my point - those other teams did not play the same level of competition.

    Safe travel to all the girls competing. Our girls fly out tomorrow. Hopefully it won't be a wintery week up there. Our opinions aside, I am sure all the teams will put on a show.

    P.S. My car is leased so I guess I can't actually wager it ; )
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    wcbasketball
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    Post by wcbasketball Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:59 am

    "Eagle1", at least be a man and admit what you posted. You clearly edited your post since I responded and that is not cool. Don't try to make me look like an idiot when you clearly said that Ascension bench would beat Westdale by 40 points. This is why I hate the choice for somebody to edit their post because people like you can try to deny what you said. What a joke!
    You also made a point to mention that none of those teams played a AAAA size tournament and you said you would wager your car that Ascension would win by 40. Come on, don't wimp out from your original comments just to try to make yourself look better. You said what you said and I called you out on it. I have no respect for somebody that tries to lie about what they said. I wish that Rick could and would post what you originally said as I found it absolutely ridiculous. Do yourself and all of us a favour, be a man and stick behind the original words you posted and don't try to do the pansy thing by editing it and then tell me to go read your post and find what I said you stated. Don't lie.
    Sorry about the long winded posts as maybe it may be too much for you to read. At least I will stick by exactly what I responded and you sir, are a liar for changing yours. I hope that "BK" at least was able to read what you posted originally before you edited it as he is the only one that posted between our two posts. That was a low and sad move Eagle 1. Pathetic.
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    wcbasketball
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    Post by wcbasketball Tue Nov 18, 2008 11:00 am

    Oh yeah, it clearlt states on your original brutal post that you last edited it at 8:44 this morning. GOTCHA!
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    Eagle1
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    Post by Eagle1 Tue Nov 18, 2008 11:14 am

    wcbasketball - do you even read my posts? GOTCHA what?????

    Look back at my reply to you - I saiid I will remove my comment on beating Stratford since it sounded disrespectful and THAT IS WHAT I DID!!!

    That's why it has been edited (obviously). That is the only thing I removed. I did not say one word about beating Westdale by 40 points.

    I am sure there are others who read it who can verify that (someone please do so this person can stop his silly accusations)

    YOU are obviously a liar or you are not bothering to read my posts.

    This is all becoming a little much now. I stand by what I have said. It is there for everyone to read except for the part that I said I would remove. READ the post before you reply and make yourself look silly. And BTW who are you? It is nice to make accusations that I am a liar while you hide behind your username.
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    bk
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    Post by bk Tue Nov 18, 2008 12:01 pm

    thats move forward folks, its starting to sound like the hoop-la! lets talk more about the games, ofsaa is an exciting week for me, can't wait
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    bearscoach
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    Post by bearscoach Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:13 pm

    I hope Christine doesn't get as tired as she did at the Centennial tournament. Five games in a three day period at OFSAA is tough on any player, but even more when a player has to carry the load. Let's hope she can do her best in all the games that Ascension plays.
    I was at the Centennial tournament and I thought the Eagles were less than stellar in the blowout by Thomson. I was assured that Christine was worn out but that they could play a lot better and would when they make it to OFSAA. I wish them luck.
    BTW, WCB never hides behind his username. Most perusers of this board know him instantly, as do I, by his reference to his high school team.
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    Post by Eagle1 Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:31 pm

    Not really interested about WCB. That conversation is over. Let's talk about the games.

    I did not see the Thomson game but our coach has said that it was definitely their worst game of the year. A few of the girls put forth less than a full effort in the second half.

    Christine should be OK. There is one game on Thursday and (hopefully) two more of Friday. It the girls do as I expect, I think she may have some opportunities to rest a bit. Should they be playing Saturday, there is quite a gap between games. My biggest concern is that she needs to stay out of foul trouble. I don't know how the referees north of Superior call games, but my experience having been to OFSAA a few times, is that the further you get out of the GTA, the tighter the games are called.
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    Post by bk Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:36 pm

    the game is definitely officiated differently away from the gta, most officials away from the gta are not used to the aggressive physical game that is typically toronto,
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    wcbasketball
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    Post by wcbasketball Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:39 pm

    This will be the last thing I post in response to Eagle 1. As "Bearscoach" stated, my username is "WCbasketball" which stands for Winston Churchill Basketball, so I am not hiding anything. You made the point that you would beat Tillsonburg Glendale by 40 points using the bench for most of the game and you stated that you would wager your car. That is the one point I felt you crossed the line with. Are you gonna still say that you never made that point?
    I am not a big fan of some of your posts as I am sure some people are not of mine. The one thing that you must understand is that the players do the playing so there is no need for you to trash talk. Saying you would wager your car is beyond trash talk. Ascension is a great team that doesn't need your help in promoting them
    Though we agree to 100% disagree, I would offer to shake your hand both before and after if our teams met. You are entitled to your opinion but that doesn't mean I have to agree with it. I feel that self-promotion is not necessary especially when a team like Ascension clearly is well respected. Your team beat a very strong D'Youville in the Peel Final and boost two of the best players in Christine Hyde and Michelle Asare.
    Again, I wish Ascension all the best this weekend as I will be cheering for them in spite of you. I am very excited as I think that the GTA has great medal prospects in AA and AAAA with also a good chance at a medal in AAA. I will be thrilled if Ascension wins the AA and I have made that very clear especially if they beat General Amhearst. Good luck this weekend and let's concentrate on the girls result and cheer them on in a respectful manner.
    Again, I am the coach of the Senior Girls team at Winston Churchill and have never hidden who I am.
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    Post by Eagle1 Tue Nov 18, 2008 4:37 pm

    wcb - my final comment as well:

    If you would like, I will ask Rick to repost the original comment. What I said was that Glendale defeated Stratford Central by 6 in the AA semi-finals and that "I would wager my car" that we would defeat STRATFORD (not Glendale) by 40. I never denied the comment (hence my wink wink at the end of my next post regarding the fact that I can't wager a leased car).

    You felt that my comment was disrespectful, I agreed, so I removed that part of the post. Then you accused me of lying and editing (which I did to remove that comment). You did NOT read my post correctly. IF you are going to write a 3 page rebuttal, at least read my words correctly. When I removed that part, I thought the controversy was over. I said what I said - and I removed it. I did not think Stratford players would be on Hooptown but, in retrospect, I did not want to belittle them. Once again, I was trying to emphasize the point that Ascension has played a much more difficult schedule than Glendale or Bishop McDonnell. Perhaps I should have worded it this way ... If Glendale or McDonnell were playing in ROPSAA Tier 1, would they have won the AAAA championship. I am not "promoting" Ascension ... I was not pleased with the seedings and opened that up for discussion. I have been on this forum for eight years and I would like someone to say that I have ever gone on Hooptown to "promote" my team.

    I hope that clears it up.

    We all come on this board to discuss because we are passionate about the game. Let's not turn this into a farce.
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    hoopsdreaming13
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    Post by hoopsdreaming13 Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:50 pm

    yikes, being from hamilton - i really enjoy all the discussion . . . .but did someone really say that they could beat Westdale by 40 . . . playing their bench?
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    Post by Xavier Rimrocker Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:21 pm

    No, no one said that.


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    Post by wcbasketball Wed Nov 19, 2008 1:12 am

    Nobody said or posted that somebody said they could beat Hamilton Westdale by 40.
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    Post by hoopsdreaming13 Wed Nov 19, 2008 4:01 pm

    [quote="wcbasketball"]"Eagle1", at least be a man and admit what you posted. You clearly edited your post since I responded and that is not cool. Don't try to make me look like an idiot when you clearly said that Ascension bench would beat Westdale by 40 points. This is why I hate the choice for somebody to edit their post because people like you can try to deny what you said. What a joke!


    Misprint???
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    fan in the stands
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    Post by fan in the stands Wed Nov 19, 2008 4:13 pm

    Etobicoke Classic was a great tournament with many close games between the top teams in the province. Louis Riel is actually a 'A' sized school that competed at AA last year. They finished in the quarters but wanted a greater challenge this year by playing up. That was the players decisions. I fully respect GA continuing on at the AA level if that is what the girls wanted to do.

    Good luck to all
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    Post by Xavier Rimrocker Wed Nov 19, 2008 4:25 pm

    Louis Riel is A-sized but, as they have a sports academic program that accepts students from across the city, one assumes they will always choose to play up.


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    Post by Baseline Wed Nov 19, 2008 4:48 pm

    Interesting conversations. With respect to the rankings,somebody mentioned that the records are not as important as who you played. I agree with that. There are some teams that sport impressive records that do not play the top teams or who do not do well in the top tournaments. As far as the top tournaments, you have to include SOSI as one of the best. Look who played in it.
    Westdale
    Sarnia Northern
    Waterloo CI
    STM
    St, Mary's
    General Ahmurst
    St. Johns
    Govenor Simcoe
    St. Annes
    Blessed Trinity
    2 others I can't recall, anyone know?
    Simcoe beat Westdale in the final.
    No easy games that weekend.

    Someone also mentioned that it would be great to have the top 16 teams compete, regardless of size. Wouldn't that be a great idea. Have a post OFSAA Tournament with the top 4 teams from each OFSAA division. Would be interesting to list these teams after this weekend is over with. Probably a nice draw.....

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